Ethanol enhanced fuel

[car.davies]

Can anyone enlighten me about the above. I asked my wife to get me some petrol, specifying that it needed to be of the plus variety. Well, she got some of the fuel from United Fuels, who are running an ethenol enhanced fuel. It;s the green stuff. It claims to have an Octane level of 95, yet is cheaper than the normal ULP. I've yet to put any in my bike, so before I do, does anyone have any advice, ie DON'T.
Cheers
Davo


for now

[David Lahey]

Good question Davo

The ethanol content is currently limited to 10% here in Queensland - not sure what % yours is up there but any ethanol increases the risk of you having fuel problems in your bike due to the way ethanol absorbs water from the atmosphere (bike tanks are not sealed). Modern cars have less problems because car fuel systems are sealed. Notice I said less problems because you really don't know how well the fuel has been stored or transported before you bought it so it may have quite a bit of water in it already when you buy it. If you have petrol containing ethanol in any fuel system you had better hope none of the water separates out.

Your bike (having a carburettor as opposed to the fuel injection of a car) would probably run differently because petrol containing ethanol:
Contains more oxygen than normal petrol (leaner fuel/air mixture)
Is a different density (different fuel height in the carby)
Has a different viscosity (different flow through jets)

If you are a bit of a nostalgia freak for 1970s bikes like me, the ethanol also poses a problem for those sexy fibreglass fuel tanks from back then as it attacks the polyester resin that holds everything together. Because I don't trust petrol suppliers not to sneak a bit of ethanol into the supposedly non-ethanol containing petrol I use in them, I have recently taken the precaution of applying an internal coating of epoxy resin to all my fibreglass fuel tanks.

The reason why the ethanol containing fuel is cheaper is because it contains less energy per unit of volume. The fuel companies tried to sell it at a premium to start with because it was being promoted as environmentally friendly but the big car clubs like RACQ here pointed out that it actually should give worse fuel economy than normal fuel in a car because of the reduced energy/litre. The fuel companies quickly reduced the price and have kept it about 4cpl below normal petrol since then. Now that crude oil is very expensive, petrol containing ethanol should be more than 4cpl cheaper than normal petrol. In Australia, the ethanol is made from sugar cane and grain crops and supports our farmers nicely and is not much of an issue yet for our food supply, but in poor countries production of crops for ethanol production as a supplement for car fuel has caused massive distortions in the pattern of food production, resulting in famines etc so the green credentials of it have become very difficult to defend.

On the bright side, using petrol containig ethanol does improve our international balance of payments (lots), reduces air pollution (a tiny bit), helps farmers, probably cleans up your car engine combustion chambers (a bit) and if your car fuel injection mapping is a bit on the rich side, it may even improve your fuel economy (a bit).

[Stu]

Davo,
I've often wondered about the ethanol blended in 2 strokes and I havent found anything that's good with it yet. I dont use in my cars or the TY. Someone else may know more...

[Gary B]

Hey Stu,
Your TY seems to run it's best when it starts with 'Bang' (Fireworks aside).
Bought time it saw some daylight again.

[car.davies]

Cheers guys,
Good job I checked. I was tempted to put it in my car, even with a 70:1 mix, but not now. Any ideas how to get rid of the fuel, as I don't want to just through it. not down the drain or on the dirt. Got to be a bit green or we will have even fewer places to ride.

Davo
for now

[PA]

Put it in the wife's car, or sell it cheap in some dark back alley.

[Trango]

Use it for cleaning the air filter or washing parts.

[S.E.Lucas]

I've been using the e10 in my hilux for a while now. Run a fair few tanks through it and no problems

[Stu]

Haha Gary, I forgot about the bloody bang! Yep I'm getting the old girl out for a ride soon at Kiama. I need the practice!
I like the comment to sell 'the ethanol down in a dark alley'.

[gordonmichaellee]

just so people know, there is a simple test to see if there is any ethenol in the fuel you are using.
step 1
get 2 acurate measuring jugs ( chemistry lab equipment is best ) lets say 1 litre

step 2
measure exactly a quantity of fuel, lets say 500ml

step 3
measure exactly 100ml of water

step 4
add them together and leave for a day or so with a lid on.

analysis

if there is no ethenol in the fuel you will have exactly 500ml of petrol sat on top of exactly 100ml of water

if there is ethenol in the fuel you will have less than 500ml of petrol, lets say for description in this example, 470ml and 130ml of ethenol water solution

conclusion
as we all know oil and water don't mix, but plant derived ethenol does mix with water hence the water/ethenol layer will increase.

I made up the figures, and I don't know if all of the ethenol will be absorbed out of the fuel, nor do I kow if there is any mathmatical conclusion about ratio to be derived from this. perhaps someone with more chemical knowledge could comment.

Also shouldn't this topic be in technical help.