[SOLVED] First trails bike, but what size?

[jml]

Edit: Decided the best solution was to checkout a trials school and get a feel for the bikes before I venture out and buy something.

Hello all,

I'm sorry for bringing up this topic again, I assume it's something that must pop-up regularly on the forums. I've been looking for my first trials bike and I'm dumbfounded by the amount of advice out there and options of bike capacity: 125, 200/250/290/300cc bikes.

Now I do understand that most any bike can be tuned back to make them less aggressive (using various mods) but at the moment I'd much rather something I can just jump on and start riding and learning the core skills. I may start to avoid the bike if It's going to require a bunch of work (mods to tame it down) before I even get a few hours on it. Most of the riding up front will be basic drills, but I'd very much like to feel that I control the bike, I fear that if the bike is powerful and potentially intimidating I would not ride it as often.

So far I've heard fore and against the 125cc bikes, 200's seem to be a fairly middle ground (but are Unicorns to find for sale) and the 250's are also very hotly debated (fore and against). I'm not afraid of having to upgrade, but I'd rather not have something I feel is more than I can handle. I've added some details below about my height/weight and riding experience, thoughts?

Would the 125/200 be too small for basic drills and training. For the first few months Its only real purpose will be getting me comfortable to the style of riding and more about learning to balance/turn and get my bearings on the bike.

Thanks for reading

My Details
Height: 178cm (~5ft 10.5inches)
Weight: 84-88kg (185 - 190 lbs)
Riding experience: I have been riding on the road for around 12 months (LAMS 250cc 4T) and have also acquired recently a 250cc Enduro (WR250F) but I would say I have 5 hours of riding on this. Very much a novice/noob

[cota]

Hi - yes, a question to which there may be as many opinions as riders. I can relate my experience and that comes from coming back to riding trials after 19years off the bike and after having started back on a Fantic 245 (212cc) which had more than enough power and traction (and weight!) I then hopped on a 2009 Beta EVO 125 and wow! Bought one and I found that it helped me gain skills that I might never have had or had opportunity to learn. It required me to 'ride' the bike rather than just wind on the throttle and hang on. It was nimble and easy to handle but did need to be kept on the revs. While you and I are about the same height, I am 10-12kg lighter. I then bought a new 2012 Beta EVO 200 and have really enjoyed the bike. It didn't need the revs as much as the 125 and is very willing and strong down low with ample power and torque. Certainly a controllable bike and well worth considering. As you say, there a fewer of them around, although I do have mine for sale - where are you (I am in WA). I have recently bought a 2014 Jotagas 250 - I bought it not because it was a 250 and I wanted more than the 200, it was just one of those "I liked the bike". I am no expert and the difference between the two bikes is unlikely due to just the different engine capacity and I know that the Beta EVO 200 would still take me everywhere that the Jotagas 250 will take me - because it is me that is riding it. The ideal way is to get to a trial and have a look around, talk with people and ideally have a ride of different bikes (if you can find willing riders). Enjoying riding trials and being successful is not often determined by size of the engine but the skills of the rider. A good rider could ride many different bikes well.
Hasn't answered your question, but just shared my thoughts.
Good luck and hope you get a bike and enjoy trials.

[jml]

Hey cota,

where are you (I am in WA)

Sydney!

Hasn't answered your question, but just shared my thoughts.

Your reply is what I am after to be honest. A lot of the threads I have been reading generally start and end with "Buy a 250cc bike, you're too heavy" or just "I started on a 290, was fine for me". Your narrative was quite useful and has definitely reinforced what I have been reading about the 125cc bikes being a great beginner steed that forces a closer focus on technique verses powering out of your problems.



I'm very much leaning towards a 125-200ish bike, my father also reminded me that I should checkout a ride day or maybe even do some sort of rider training day.

[Kombivan]

your first trials bike will probably determine what you like 1973 was my first trials bike a montesa cota 247 and its taken me this long to move up to a 349. I like the twin shocks because they have a seat you can sit on and have a relax if your out all day and their road registerable. I see many sherco and gas gas very cheap I assume its because there only a one day comp bike not really an all rounder. I know guys that purchased 325 bultacos for their first bike and been happy with them all their lives 175 - 350 is the choice range and I would suggest the plastic tank model bultacos any montesa rl250, ty175, 80's ty250 its up to you and what you can get your hands on but wether its a 175 or a 350 2-3 months you will think your an expert anyway I myself hate to say this but its the appearence that gets me if it looks good chances it performs good. If your aggressive then one of those things with out a seat might be your thing. The trials are geared down so a 350 trials bike is not like a 350 road bike or enduro top speed for my 349 cota will be about 105k's. It doesn't really matter your either going to trash it or treasure it its all about being youuuu and which bike you think is you. Bear in mind the plastic tanks cannot be repaired when damaged so steel tank or fiberglass as fiberglass is easily repaired. when repairing a fiberglass tank flexible marine resin is good as it doesn't crack so easily as its flexible.

Whatever you buy first will determine how you ride how you treat your throttle and every thing else its called habbit you want to develope habbits that will serve you, I started with a 247 cota later I got on a ty175 and it supprised me the rl250 was the bike that had most control in rocks don't know why and so far 250 is the largest trials bike I have ridden. Don't get a 125 cota as the gear lever shaft sits against the inside casing and if it falls on the gear lever it can break the bike internally unsure if the 175 is the same but the 250's don't have that problem..

[Trials09]

Hi
I was once in the same situation as you, which bike to buy. One piece of advice I received as a beginner, "if you need to modify the bike to tame it, (such as flywheel weights, low comp head and the like) then that's not the bike for you". Bikes such as 280, 290 and 300's are high end competition bikes so give then a miss for now.

The remaining bikes, 125, 200, and 250 is where you should be looking. 125's are used in the junior competition class and are tuned for performance, needing more throttle and technique.
Given that you're a beginner perhaps winding the throttle further might put you of balance.

200's are a good starting bike, they are more docile than the rest especially if you put a smaller sprocket on the front, and this makes it very tractable and easy to manoeuvre in tight turns. The same goes for the 250's just perkier. The most common mod is to change the front sprocket for a smaller one by one tooth.

I was 88kg and riding ' C ' grade lines on a 200 bike very happily. The best way to make a choice is to test ride.

Good luck.

[jml]

Thanks Kombivan & Trials09 for the advice

The best way to make a choice to test ride.

Currently in the process of signing up for trails School, so this will be the best test for me if the sport is correct for me and what size donk I need.

[Kombivan]

Forget everything I said get yourself a trials bike that has a good engine and doesn't have to be restored your a beginner and you want a bike to get on and ride with no hassles, practice listening to engines with a long screwdriver listening for bearing noise and piston slap a good motor will make some noise a bad motor will make more noise than a good motor. check the forks for rust and the shockies for leakage rust and pits in the shaft. Check the wheel spokes for tightness and running true. check if chain is stretched or sideways movement, and if the sprokets teeth are worn out. is the rubber old and perished or new and flexible. Remember your trials bike finds you you don't find it. Sprokets and chains are no big deal but they tell you alot about how the bike is treated and maintained. Italjet parts are too hard to source and their heavy. Remember a 175 will sit you on your arse just as quick as a 350 my first scrambler was a yamaha 175. first trials was a basket case 247 montesa I rebuilt it and loved it. Also pay attention as to how fussy the owner is. Montesa 350 1981-1984 front hubs break can be replaced with an earlier 1979-1980 350 montesa parrallel hub. Bikes with reed valves perform really well. Japanese bikes are usually well built.

[jml]

Forget everything I said get yourself a trials bike that has a good engine and doesn't have to be restored

I totally agree with this and also agree with not buying something that is going to be a lot of work. I bought a dirt bike a while ago and failed to pickup on some minor problems that ended up meaning I couldn't just jump on it right away and ride it (poorly maintained forks, counter sprocket, tuning problems) I normally follow a fairly detailed list of things to check, but was distracted and rushed my checks. It meant that I spent my first few months neck deep trying to sort out parts and repairs on something I had yet to ride, which is really a bummer for a new rider. I'd really prefer to buy a trials bike that I can at least get a few hassle free hours out of before having to turn a wrench on it (within reason), I don't mind wrenching on things but I guess there needs to be some kind of reward for the work or at least a lower barrier to entry.

I'm going to head up to the thehellteam tomorrow and sort out my registration for the trials school. I think it's going to be the best way to trial (mind the pun) the bikes and see what is the best for my weight/skill.

[jml]

Follow up: After doing a Trials training day hosted by the thehellteam http://www.thehellteam.com/catalogue/c196/c250 I discovered for my weight and ability that a 125cc bike was fine, I've now purchased a 125cc bike off the forums!